Fetch & Funnel is a growth marketing agency purpose-built to connect growing brands with their ideal customers. We specialize in customer acquisition via influence marketing, growth hacking, digital marketing, sales funnels and conversion rate optimization.
On this episode of the rich dad, poor on podcasts. We have Samir Elka Mooney, who is the founder over at fetch and funnel. And they're spending shoot roughly a hundred million plus every year for their clients across YouTube, Facebook, and Google. But today we dive into one of their clients, the summer board, a super awesome snowboard slash skateboard. You can shred on the concrete. I've eaten it a couple of times, but it is awesome. We dive into creative how he understands the conversion cycles, how financing was a killer game changer for them and how to boost the LTV and conversion rates. So post-purchase surveys make sure to tune in, if you do not want to miss this one.
Um, the other thing that you really need to pay attention to with financing is what is the approval rate of people? Because it's, it's, it's almost like a charge card, right? Like you, you've got to put in your car, your social security number and all those, you know, key pieces. Right. And so, yeah, so then that's something that we, uh, we've been through. I think we've been through three different, um, different lenders or whatever or whatever the correct word is with summer board because we're with one of the bigger name brands. And we found out that the, even though their monthly payments were lower. So that seemed more appealing that could, that potentially help with ad copy and help with conversion rates. Their approval rate was a lot lower.
You're listening to the rich add poor ed podcast, where we break down the financial principles that rich advertisers are deploying today to turn advertising into profit and get tons of traffic to their websites without killing their cash. These advertisers agencies, affiliates brands are responsible for managing over a billion dollars a year in ad spend. You'll hear about what's working for them today. They're rich ads and we'll roast their Epic failures and crappy ads on the internet with four ads. Let's get into it.
Everybody we're back in business with another episode of the rich dad, poor dad podcast, got your host, Dylan Carpenter in the house. And I am pumped to chat on the specific topic and guests we have today. I'll give you a little insider. I've actually used the product. I've eaten on it multiple times here in Austin, Texas. It is so fun. So cool. It'll be the brand we're talking about, but when it comes down to the man behind the scenes, we got Mr. SU Samir ELCA Mooney. Hopefully I didn't slaughter that too bad. My bad man. We got the F the founder chief growth officer over at fetch and funnel. They're responsible for spending roughly, you know, a hundred million plus on ads across Facebook, Google, YouTube. And they're actually, you're legitimately killing the game right now, but today we'll be diving into one of their brands, summer board, or one of their clients. So it's going to be pretty exciting. The summit what's up, man. Heck yeah.
Hey Don. Glad to be here. Excited to be here. Appreciate you having
Likewise, man, it's been a little bit in the works, but finally made it happen.
I know I'm pumped. Yeah.
So give everybody a little bit of background of kind of who you are, you know, what you're getting into these days. So everybody kind of has some context.
Yeah, definitely. I appreciate it. So yeah, I mean, as you said, I, I, uh, founded fetch and funnels, so we're a full funnel, digital advertising agency really specializing in scaling e-commerce brands and assisting just, yeah, good, well spending, uh, e-comm brands that are looking to get better results and, and all that fun stuff, uh, started the company because it had some agency, life had some advertising life, you know, did the digital marketing manager at a couple startups and things like that, and really saw the good, the bad and the ugly of the agency world. And just wanted to get out there and be one of those agencies that you enjoy partnering with, and that really are focused on your brand and really focused on getting you results and, uh, yeah. Have sort of like a feeling of a vested interest in your business, if that makes sense. So, um, yeah, summer board is one of those brands where we worked with them, uh, or them for a couple of years now and have had a blast doing it. And, you know, just so you just, like I'm saying partnered up with him really closely on way more than just the advertising side strategy website, you name it. Um, yeah. And, uh, and like you said, I've also eaten once, but you know what? I got back right back up after a little while and, uh, I love riding itself.
The funniest part is, is, you know, I I've snowboard a good amount, so my, you know, I can probably figure this out pretty quick. I decided to take it down Hill first. And that was like my first time riding and I tore my knees up, man.
Yeah. Not the way to do it for sure. Not the way to do it. I've never snowboarded. And then I got a little cocky early on and then that's where I, uh, add my took, uh, took an edge and, uh, went flying. But yeah, any who don't want to discourage anybody from buying it, cause it is a blast once you, once you get on it and you learn how to ride it.
Oh yeah. And for y'all who want some context, check this thing out summer board.com. It is sick. It's a revolutionary and you got to shred the NARS some way. Right. You know,
Got it. Well, heck yeah, man.
You know, we'd love to kind of dive into the rich and pour out AKA what's working and what's not working basically. So how about we kind of start off with the rich ad segment what's working good for y'all right now. I know you sent over an ad that absolutely killed it with y'all's rich hat.
Yeah. So, I mean, I think that the ad I sent over shows sort of the holistic strategy of, of really sort of the top of funnel traffic. So this is definitely one of those brands that you really need to look at the entire funnel, like, you know, from a 20,000 foot view and also really dig into what type of creative you need to get in front of, you know, sort of yeah. Anybody at the right time, because this is a very expensive product. There's a long purchase decision. And so top of funnel is all about grabbing attention, getting somebody interested in this thing, like what the heck is this thing? What is, what is this person doing? Is this a makeshift thing this person made is this legit product, all that kind of stuff. Right. And then that's where then, you know, middle of funnel, bottom of funnel becomes more education and how it works and reviews and testimonials and all that fun stuff.
So you get me across the finish line and making that purchase, but yeah, on the top of funnel side for that prospecting traffic to find new cold traffic, right? Whether it's someone who's never written a snowboard before, never skateboarded before, but could be genuinely interested to hardcore snowboarders that could pick up this thing and ride really quickly. Right. Um, and it's a tricky sort of a tricky, uh, problem to solve because click through rate doesn't necessarily mean quality traffic in this instance. And there's so many times that we look at ads and we say, Oh, this ad has an amazing click-through rate. So it's killing it. Right. And in most instances I'd say that's a fair our metric to be looking at. Right. And, and saying like, Hey, this is got a great click through rate. It's doing really well. If I'm selling flowers and people are clicking through great, they're interested in my flowers.
Um, but this is one of those brands where you could get a bunch of people that just are so intrigued what it is, but aren't qualified in any way, shape or form. They're not interested in this thing. They're not going to put the time and effort into learning it. Just whatever there's plethora of reasons, why someone wouldn't buy it and that's okay. Um, but yeah, and so it's, it's almost like a happy medium of showcasing the board in a unique way. And so for those of you who haven't been to the website, or haven't checked out this product, it's a, essentially an electric skateboard that allows you to ride it like a snowboard. So there's these sort of two center wheels in the middle of that. Those are where the motors are and they spend 360 degrees and then you're sort of outside normal skateboard wheels are your, uh, your sort of your outside edges, like you would on a snowboard.
And so you can slide this thing side to side, you can do three sixties. You can do, you can go onto the edge and slide, you know, like you're stopping just like you would on a snowboard. Uh, and so it's something where you want, so you can get really good with it and you can do really cool tricks, right. But you want to get, you want to showcase enough flare and enough, uh, sort of advantage Strider if you will, so that you get someone intrigued and they go check it out, but you also don't want to go. So, so far off the deep end of, I mean, we've got pro riders that are shredding in, on the skate park and that looks way more intimidating for someone. Right. Um, and so you don't want to go that far where then people are like, Oh, Whoa, this is some cool red bull video.
Let me check it out. And then they're just, they're out. They peace out two seconds later because they're like, Oh, I'm, I'm not sponsored by red bull. I'm not going to buy this thing. Right. Um, and so it's, yeah, it's sort of this tricky thing. And it, it is something that you, you have to have video. So, I mean, for everybody running ads, like no matter what brand you are, if you sell an information product or a, or a e-com brand or whatever, you always should be testing images and videos all the time. Right. Because we have some clients that images are King. We have some clients that videos are King. We have some clients that it's, it's actually right in the middle that performs the best where it's like a, a still image that has a little bit of motion added to it, right.
To just catch someone's attention, see the motion and then stop and read the ad copy or check out the app or whatever. But this is a brand that like needs video video is King, right? Because you need to showcase the product, you need to see how it works. Otherwise you don't really understand it. We retarget with images cause you already know what it is. And I can just grab your attention with the board and some coupon code or something like that. Um, but yeah. And so again, it's yeah. So with this ad, the one that, uh, we're highlighting here is kind of one of our best performing ads. It, it is right in that middle ground of grabbing your attention because you know, persons riding really fast. Um, there's a little bit of a downhill action, but not too much of a downhill action. Um, but they're not, they're not going, I mean, we have some videos where they like people go all out and they're riding, you know, they're doing some really cool stuff.
Um, and so it you're like within the first two, three seconds, I've got your attention because this he's immediately sliding sideways. And you're like, Whoa, what is this thing? Is this person someone going downhill on a longboard? What is it? Um, but it's not too technical where, yeah. Where someone's doing three sixties, they're jumping in the air. They're doing any of that so that it's not too, uh, yeah, but it doesn't look like, Whoa, this is intimidating. Or, or, or, I mean, let's be real, right. People click on ads all the time and then spend 15 seconds on the website. And so, yeah, same thing. Right. We've got a video on the website that showcases some tricks and I don't want you to immediately bounce from the website because you're, you're like, Oh, this thing's way too advanced for me.
I love how y'all have some of the copy phrase, turn your city into a snow resort and shred summer board for as low as a dollar 48 per day. I mean, you're, you're hitting there right on the head there to show how, you know, how reasonable it is when you kind of, you know, can finance it out. But also how, you know, you can kind of position it. So y'all's copy style here is pretty killer. I'd say
I appreciate it. Yeah. And that was actually funny enough. Some of the feedback we got, one of the, one of our best ad copy was feedback we got from the client when we actually forced him, I say forced, but he was, he was pretty chill about it, but asked him to call a bunch of cart. Abandoners like straight up call them and ask them, like, why didn't you buy the board? I just want to know, Hey, I'm the founder. You know, I just like, I just want honest feedback. Why didn't you buy the board? Um, trick, trick piece of that is people won't always be honest over the phone. So probably like a abandoned cart survey or something like that via Hotjar or something might, might give you more, uh, honest answers. But one of the most frequent answers of course was, Oh, I just wanted to see like how much it was and, you know, was there shipping or not?
And I can't afford it. And that's what a lot of people said and is interesting when we had that sort of open conversation, you know, it was like, how many of these people are snowboarders? Oh, a decent chunk of them. Oh, how much do you pay for a, you know, I don't know. I'm not, I've never snowboarded or skied, so I'm, I'm not gonna say all the right lingo, but how much do you pay for like a season pass or whatever. Right. Um, it's a lot more than this thing costs. If you finance this thing and bring it down on a monthly payments plan, right. For, you know, not that long. And then you get to ride this for the next, whatever 10 years or something like that. I mean, I've, I've had mine for a long years and years and it's never, it's all, you know, battery hasn't degraded it or anything like that. So yeah. I mean, so when you start to angle it that way, then it's like, Oh, well, yeah, I don't want to dish out the 1600. I have it, but I don't want to hear like, Oh, well I pay way more on a season pass and it's only good for four months and it's over and I've paid that money. And that's it,
When it comes to how pricey this is, what kind of costs do you look at on a Facebook site out of curiosity, I know it's a long, you know, conversion window or cycle essentially, but like what kind of goals do you put internally when you have a product that's, you know, more than a thousand bucks.
Yeah. So this is one where yeah. Attribution is always like your worst and best friend at the same time. Um, I mean, we're, we're consistently hitting three, four X row S across. I mean, if you just say across all channels combined, I'd say pretty much right around there. Um, it is something that there's a bit of seasonality, of course. So we step on the gas quite a bit, right before we know a season's gonna hit. So, you know, October numbers are going to be a little bit lower than that because November, December, they're going to be a lot higher than that. And we're just trying to drive a lot of traffic early on to grab your attention, get you in the retargeting pool, not pay those November, December premiums to find new people. Um, and again, you have to think about this purchase. Like, I mean, if you look at attribution, it says there's a lot of people that just land on this website and buy the product, but I don't believe, uh, and so that is a tricky, yeah, it's a, it's a tricky thing to really out.
Um, and I think maybe we might even get into this a little bit more later, but it is something that you need to figure out to predict your ad costs and stuff like that. Right. Because yeah, exactly. Like I'm saying you want to ramp up, but you're not going to see those returns within the first couple of weeks necessarily. Um, but then you also don't want to pull back on your retargeting because you want to make sure, you know, you might bump up your retargeting for the next two months from that, uh, sort of overspending or, you know, a lot more spending on the prospecting side to continue getting in front of those people. Um, but yeah, and then the other thing too is once you're really into multi-channel, so we're running Google, we're running YouTube, we're running Facebook, we're running Snapchat, we're doing affiliate earning all this stuff. Um, if you go and you calculate direct Rojas and all of the platforms, and then add all that up, if you, if we reported that back to the client, that would be a higher revenue number than what his total revenue. So you can't do that. You have to, you know, so it's a, it's another thing that you've really got to figure out. Like we can't pull all the levers at the same time, because if we pull all the levers at the same time, we won't really know exactly which lever worked the best. Right. So I don't know if that makes sense, but a hundred percent
Now is the, was the financing something that's been around for a bit or was it something y'all incorporated over time? I'm kind of curious on, you know, what kind of impact that would have for this kind of product. Do you see a boost in conversion rates because you have that ability to pay as you go versus shell off that thousand thousand plus out of the gate.
Yeah. This is an interesting one that, um, you, you sort of need to be a numbers person to get into this because there's so many different metrics to look at when you're, when you're yeah. When you have financing on your website. Um, and it's a conversation. I think we've had like very serious deep conversations and looked at the numbers like every two or three months with, with summer board. Um, I would say anyone that sells a product that's more than two or $300 or any brand that you would buy multiple products, great example is fashion. Right. Definitely add financing because there's just no reason not to offer it. Um, and I mean, if you go to any major fashion brand website, now they all have some sort of after Afterpay or whatever it is some sort of financing option. And I'd say for yeah, 80% of our clients that fit in either one of those boats, we have either got them to go on offering financing or they already were offering financing.
We do see the conversion rates go up, um, for sure. And that is something that you immediately have to pay attention to. Great. I, through financing on the website, do I have a higher conversion rate? Do I not have a higher conversion rate? You have to figure that stuff out. Um, the other thing that you really need to pay attention to with financing is what is the approval rate of people? Because it's, it's almost like a charge card, right? Like you've got to put in your car, your social security number and all those key pieces. Right. And so, yeah, so then that's something that we, uh, we've been through. I think we've been through three different, um, different lenders or whatever, whatever the correct word is with summer board, because we met with one of the bigger name brands. And we found out that the, even though their monthly payments were lower.
So that seemed more appealing that could, that potentially help with ad copy and help with conversion rates. Their approval rate was a lot lower. And so that was something we saw right away, like in the back end, right. We saw like going from a whatever, 60, 70% approval rate to like a 50% approval rate or 40% approval rate. So that's another big number, right. That you're like, great. And then, you know, and then he's emailing all these people, Hey, I saw that you didn't get approved. We have another option that you can apply for here. Like I've already been burned. I didn't get approved. I already gave my social security number ones. I'm not going to do it again. I mean, that's just right. That's just human nature and that's cool. But, and so yeah, you, you have to kind of look at all of those things.
Right. And then, and then the other weird thing, and this is one that we haven't like figured out. And, um, especially with this product, it happens more often than I'd like, which I don't really see as often with some of our other, I guess like less costly items, but still finance is still quite frequently financed. Is people getting approved and not buying it. Oh, weird. Why did you put your social security number and get, I mean, I don't think it's a hard pull, I think, as a soft poll, but still like, why go through that? Where the payment's too high, you know, did you just want to see if you'd get approved and now you're going to think about it. Um, that's something we haven't figured out quite yet. Um, which I think we should kind of get a survey out to those people and, and kind of try to figure that out, because that would be an important question to answer. There's a significant amount, you know, again, even if it's three people a month, that's still a couple of grand right. Extra that, you know, even though we're doing a lot more than that, but a couple of is a couple of grand, right?
Speaker 4 (20:08):
Oh, Hey, you match that up for each month. It could be 40, 50 K that's a retainer for the year, man.
Exactly. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. You can hire, you know, two interns off that practically
Speaker 4 (20:19):
So well snap. Yeah. We went down some rabbit holes. I was enjoying that one.
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Check it [email protected] So we love the segue. So of course, you know, we love to see what's working, but we also love to kind of showcase those embarrassing moments, those kinds of flaws, maybe some big changes that could have impacted the business in a negative manner there. So, I mean, what's your kind of poor ad. What's something that just, you know, you thought would try to kill it. Didn't work out so well. I know we chat a little bit about this before. What's your poor out here?
So I'll throw a one really light one and then, Oh, you're gonna make me potentially roast this client a little bit, but, uh, um, which I never want to do as I love all my clients, but, uh, yeah, so, I mean, on a, on one end on our, our bad, one of our bads was, uh, we, we came up with a great idea with the client where we wanted to have a carousel ad that highlighted multiple videos. And in each carousel sort of card, we had a different video showing almost like really shortened versions of his training videos. So on some of our.com there's, there's a bunch of training videos, you know, exactly how to, yeah. How to ride this thing, how to learn to ride this thing. It does take some time. And so it was like, Hey, how to do a hillside stop, how to do a tow side, stop, how to do like these, you know, how to do a, you know, three 60, whatever.
Um, and that ended up, we thought it was going to crush it. And we were like, Hey, we won't do it top of funnel. It's overwhelming. We'll do it sort of bottom of funnel to get people to see like the different things that you can do. And, um, that just totally flopped was like one of the worst performing ads I've ever run. And again, like, I think it's sort of that point that I was making earlier of, I think people start going, Oh shoot, this is too technical for me. Or Whoa, that looks hard. Or because when you actually go through the training videos and you start riding the thing and you start doing these things, you surprise yourself. You're like, well, that was a lot easier than I thought it was going to be because there's a motor helping you do these things and et cetera. Right. Um, but yeah, it just did awful. Um, so
A little bit, probably that same X game style, I'm not a red bull rider, so it's just almost too advanced with the people who have any embody yet to where it could kind of scare them away a little bit.
Yeah, exactly. And I mean, if you're a pretty good snowboarder, you probably see those and be like, Oh cool. This isn't that bad. That's cool. But again, I don't, you know, we play the snowboarding card a lot because it is, it does ride just like a snowboard. Um, and even sort of going through a website overhaul right now, uh, you know, we've go back and forth of how deep to go down that hole because if you niche down, that could be really great, cause you're going to speak to every snowboarder. But if you go too far down that again, I ride mine all the time. I love it. I've never snowboarded a day in my life. So if I go to this website and it's like for snowboarders, I might not convert because I've never snowboard it before. Um, yeah.
So we got your bed and um,
Oh yeah. So I mean, this, this, so summer boards on pretty much their fourth iteration of this board, um, and it's gone through quite a few iterations and, and all those kinds of things like that's good. Like every, yeah, absolutely. Like every product has, I mean, boosted board rest in peace. Like they went through a bunch of iterations of their board, right. And they were outward of every iteration and things like that. Um, and some, our board was also in the beginning, he named V2 V2. Um, but so originally he was leaf tech. That was the name of the brand. And he then turned the brand overnight with the launch of the newest board to summer board. And did the complete rebrand essentially overnight had leaf tech redirect to summer board.com launched this new board, launched it a one-page website, which is something I would never recommend anybody does.
Um, he was not a client of ours at this time. He had decided to take a hiatus for whatever reason and came back. Um, and, and like, people know what's going on. People are smart. Like this is something that I think is just such a big point that I think so many brands miss that like your clients are smart. You can't pull the wool over their eyes. I don't care what product you sell. Like people are doing research. They're looking to the point where they're going to look for coupon codes. They're going to do all of the things, right? Like they are researching your brand. They are trying to see if you're legitimate or not. Where are you manufacturing this thing? What, all of the things, right. We all do this research and we all figure it out and. Now that no one has any, you know, has nothing but time on their hands.
They're sitting at home all day. I bet they're doing even more research on this stuff that they want to buy because they are spending more money online, which is great. Um, but so yeah, he did a rebrand sort of overnight and just changed everything. Just swap everything over and never explained why never talked about why I never put that out there about, you know, what's why'd we did this. Um, and there are forums online dedicated to this, like people having the open conversation about like, what happened is this legit? Are they trying to hide something? Is that right? And it was, no, this is a good thing. We came out with such a new iteration of this board that we felt like we had to change the name. And we've actually always been summer board, but we hauled the board, the leaf tech, and we just branded the website as leaf tech.
Cause that's what we wanted to do. But actually the name of the company was actually summer board. And we decided that it was time to finally come out with what we consider the true summer board, because it had finally got to that sort of critical mass of being an awesome board. And they had ironed out all the technical stuff, all that stuff. Right. That's a really great story to tell. And that's something that I, you know, I've owned both. I have a leaf tech and a summer board. I, I would've have immediately like thought about purchasing the board and wanting to make that transition. Or if I was on the fence about buying a leaf tech immediately pushes me across the fence of buying a summer board. Right. It's it's every, it's every single person that says, Oh,
Speaker 5 (28:09):
Uh, I'm due for a cell
Phone upgrade, but I know the iPhone 12 is right around the corner and then I'm going to buy it the second it comes out. Right. It's the same thing. And so to the point where it should have even been hyped, right. This should have been something that was like, there was a veil underneath and boosted board used to do an awesome job of that, where they like hyped stuff out, um, right. With the curtain over the product or just seeing the headlight or whatever it is. And that would have been so cool to, to hype it up, to build that momentum, know that we're going to have a total drop of sales for two or three months. But the second we launched this thing, it's going to explode. And instead it was like a, it was the complete opposite, right. It was like normal sales launched this new brand.
And it's like crickets because everyone's so confused. They're like, again, they're not dumb. Okay. Maybe I see someone word for the first time and I've never seen leaf tech before in some ads. And it's just not a great one page website and whatever. I'm like, okay. Maybe I buy it. Maybe I don't. But like for all of those people that were on the fence for all of those people, right. I mean, it's it's. Yeah. And so, um, yeah, could have been done in a, in a, in a totally different way. And, and I think it also sort of, and again, I mean, I enjoy talking with you. We talked quite a bit before this podcast. I don't want to get too far down any rabbit holes, but I think there's another piece of this. That's really interesting. And that's like transparency. So like even us as an agency, like we pride ourselves on being as transparent as possible with our clients.
And I think like every brand needs to be doing that, like very seriously, where we had major cancellations when we kind of ran into some shipping issues. Right. Sort of in the beginning ish times of COVID and we should have just emailed all the clients and told them, like emailed all the customers that we're waiting for a board like, Hey, we're so sorry. This is what's going on. I hope you bear with us. If you need a refund, we totally understand. But we really hope you bear with us, give us two more months and you will have your board. Right. We're past all those issues. Now. We're not, you know, we don't have any late shipping or anything now. Um, or summer board. Doesn't I say we, because again, I feel like they're part of their brand, but, um, yeah. And so it's yeah. And instead we got a ton of cancellations or they got a ton of cancellations and everyone, we were like, freaking out what's going on?
You know, we went to the client, what's going on? Why are we getting all these cancellations is like, Oh, we're, you know, we haven't shipped to people's boards that ordered a month and a half ago. And we're like, Oh, did we email them? Do we give them any updates to be doing any of this, this, and it was like, no. And okay, well, I wouldn't, I'd be too. If I just spent $1,600 has been a month and a half and I have gotten zero updates. I have no idea if this board's on its way or not. I mean, shoot, I just bought a $300 car cover. That's handmade for my car and I've been waiting a month and like, I've called them three times, I think like this, like what's going on? Like, and they're like, Hey, we hand make it. It takes some time that the da and I'm like, okay, that's cool. I'm totally willing to wait for it. No worries. Yeah, exactly. I'll pay for that quality and I'll wait for that quality. That's cool with me. And, and yeah. So I think, yeah,
No, not a rabbit hole. Now. This is gold, everybody. I mean even brands, agency, owners, advertisers, transparency is everything. And I mean, the more you try to hide, the more it's gonna cause more harm than good without a doubt. I mean, I think being transparent in any situation is just going to help you on your human relations level and just overall help in marketing efforts.
Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. Like, and like I said, it's like your, your customers are smart.
And you mentioned that with COVID they're probably doing more research. I mean, should I am, I mean like that
Absolutely. Absolutely. Oh yeah. One of our clients that sells like shocks and stuff like that, they're, they're like the brand that crushed it the most during COVID. Cause everyone's like, I'm going to work on my Jeep. I'm going to work on my truck all this time on my hands. Now I had a lot of fun.
It's freaking out like COVID, you know, people are going to have money and most of them are pretty high ticket. So I mean, when the people who have money way more money, so it's kind of interesting how it all panned out, but man, yeah, this is fricking juicy there. So, you know, we love to kind of take a page at rich dad, poor dad book, dive into some sort of financial principles or finding financial tips. They're more or less try and find a crossroads in the marketing and financial world. So, you know, what kind of financial tip out there or, you know, principle you live by that would kind of be beneficial to the audience.
Yeah, that's an interesting one. Um, well I think, yeah, I mean there's a couple of pieces to that. I mean, one thing I guess sort of making this conversation we've been having kind of go full circle is definitely one where, um, is planning out your media spend, right? Planning out your ad spend. I think that's, that's a really important thing and that's something that we work with our clients on, right? We, we put together a quarterly goals, yearly goals, all those kinds of things. Um, but figuring out what that, like what, yeah, if you increase, if you double your spend this month, that doesn't necessarily mean that you're going to get double the sales this month. Um, and some rewards, a perfect example of that where I don't really even know how long the true customer life cycle is. I just have no idea. I have, we have really rough numbers and it's changing all the time.
And of course then two months. Yeah, for sure. It's more than two months. And of course seasonality takes a big, a big part of that. I mean, you know, cyber month is here in a couple of days. Um, people who just found out about the board in October are we're going to get a lot of those people in November with some really great sales and bottles and stuff. They're waiting for me to, I have like a thousand things in my cart. Um, but yeah, and then that's so, you know, planning that out is, is really, really important. And I've gone through this with so many brands, like where, yeah. I mean, you think like, Hey, I'm getting this row tracked right now, or return on ad spend for people who don't know the acronym right. Directly tracked in Facebook or Google or whatever, I'm getting this return.
You know, if I immediately double spend like, am I going to get return? You know what I mean? Am I going to get returns overnight? And, um, and, and in nine out of 10 times, like you're not going to, um, like we even do something interesting that I don't think a lot of, uh, of yeah. Maybe agencies or even advertisers do any of this, but we kind of look at like spend cohorts as well, and then look back at them in the future because you'll find attribution, especially in Facebook, like won't, you won't get all the true attribution from a previous period of time. And if someone makes a purchase in the future, it will still attribute the attribution to the ad in the past. I don't know if that makes sense. And so if you look at row for the last seven days today and you plug that number into a spreadsheet and then wait two weeks and then look back at that same window in time, you know, eight out of 10 times, if you're spending a decent amount of money, that ROAS will actually be higher than originally originally shown.
And so those are definitely things where those that's a sort of a little hack to try to figure out like what some of those windows look like and how long does that journey take? Um, you know, and yeah. And how many touch points and all that stuff too. Right. Does it really take to kind of get your customer across the finish line? Um, one of the things that we've found to be immensely valuable is just having like a post-purchase survey, um, of, of asking customers like whatever the most important questions are. Um, like what made you buy? Like how long have you been thinking about this purchase? Um, and most, a lot of people will fill those out. Um, Facebook's asking your customers those questions mix now. Yeah. So I mean, yeah, I mean it feels, I don't know, that's a, that's a real thing.
And actually when we just had that shipping problem with summer board that actually came to bite us in the butt because a lot of people, when you make a purchase and Facebook knows you made a purchase through an ad, they will send you a survey and they will ask you, like, how was the shipping, how was the customer experience? How was all of these things? And people were giving a really low rating of course, on any of the shipping stuff. And that had an effect on the ads that had an effect on the ad spend and stuff like that. So a negative effect, obviously we're, we're past that point and we're back in, in, in good, uh, good terms with Facebook, but yeah, so I think that's like an important thing, right? Like planning your media spend when to scale. Um, and then when those results will sort of come in and like map it out, put a spreadsheet together, um, look back at last year, it looked back at like when the spend came in, when the revenue came in, all of those metrics, um, run a post-purchase survey, ask your customers some of that information, if you can.
Um, yeah. I mean, I think that that's a big one. Right. And, and yeah, I think that that's like really, really important. Um, yeah. I don't know what else and then get a good credit card in order to, uh, maximize your points, plug inside of that good credit card. Yeah. Yeah. I always push people to make sure they're on the right credit cards to get in the right points and everything like that. Like $500,000 a month in advertising, you know, fly world, you know, around the world first class, every single month, just off that, if you have the right points, how useless our flight points though, right now that's the key thing. Cause I I'm sitting on like maybe like two to 300,000 and I'm like, dude, I gotta, I gotta do something. Jet blue just launched their, their credit cards, always 40,000 points. They send an email out to their whole list, a hundred thousand points in their credit credit right now. And, um, messaged me cause they know I'm super into credit cards and are asking my opinion on it and stuff. And I'm like, well, are you willing to eat the $99 yearly fee for the next two years until you on another flight?
Oh man flying, Hey,
Go for it. And it's totally worth it.
I get 80,000 points. I got to spend a 4k, you know, I can make a quick one here, you know? Um, yeah. I go down those rabbit holes too much. Well snap man, this has been absolutely awesome. I've enjoyed this thoroughly. I'm going to be scooping probably one of these up in the next couple of weeks. Be honest with you. Um, but um, give everybody an idea, you know, how can we support you? What are you getting into any cool future projects and kind of how can people get in touch with you? Yeah,
Yeah. Um, so I mean, fetch funnel.com, just fetch FETC H funnel F U N N E l.com. So definitely check us out. We're producing a bunch of great blog content. We're talking about some really interesting stuff there. Um, you know, one of the big things right now is especially with ad costs, going up everywhere, everyone is talking about how they can diversify, where they can go. Um, you know, we were pitching YouTube quite a bit until, uh, until some presidents decided to eat up all the YouTube ad space. Um, but like even Snapchat is an awesome place to be, right. I mean, we're, you know, it gets over 50% of Snapchat is above the age of, um, of 25 and um, those numbers are even higher on Tik TOK as well, which is another place that we're, we're in quite a bit, these days,
New Shopify integrations. That'd be huge, I think with Tech-Talk. Yeah, yeah.
And actually Facebook too. So, um, there's a new Shopify integration actually. I'm working on the blog posts today. Um, but yeah, Facebook, there's a new conversions API, um, that is going to be that's Rubin released. Um, but Shopify just released a new direct integration with it. Um, especially with all these cookie problems happening Safari already dropped it. Chrome's about to drop it. Um, so yeah, having attribution, obviously we've talked about attribution quite a bit already today that that's yeah. It's important. And so being able to take advantage of that's a big one. Um, but yeah, I mean touch funnel.com, check out our blog. We've got, if you click on any of our blog articles, you'll see on the right hand side, we've got two really great e-books one how to research and crush your competitors, right? How to look at your competitors, ads, how to sort of hack, you know, what's working for them that could be working better for you.
Um, and then we've got a great how to advertise during a pandemic, um, book on there as well, which a lot of, yeah, a lot of the things that people don't really kind of think about or little tricks you can do to increase conversion rates, like, you know, having the right banner on the top of your website and, and all those kinds of things. Um, cause you know, yeah. I mean we're still in a pandemic, so it's still, it's still very much so relevant even though he came out with it a couple months back. Uh yeah. And who knows what's gonna happen with winter could, could be even more prevalent we'll say. Um, but yeah. And of course, I mean anyone can, can message me on LinkedIn or send me an email or anything like that. I'm just [email protected] S a M I R he only looks at InMails just by the way, everybody. So who else? And mere man, this has been an absolute pleasure, man. Thanks for jumping on and thanks for everything, man. Thanks Dylan. Yeah, I appreciate it. Hope to do another one a couple months from now. We'll talk about another fun brand
Speaker 6 (41:56):
1000% man. Awesome. Thanks for listening to everybody.
Thanks so much for listening to another episode of the rich ed or ed podcast. If you're like me and listen to podcasts on the go, go ahead and subscribe on Apple podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, and rich ed [inaudible] dot com slash podcast. And if you absolutely love the show, go ahead and leave a review and a comment share with a friend. If you do take a copy screenshot of it, email me [email protected] Show me you left a review. I'll give you a free copy of the rich ad or ad book to learn more about the book, go to rich ed or a.com to leave a review that a rich ed or ed.com/review. Thanks again.
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Jason Hornung is the founder and Creative Director at JH Media LLC, the world’s #1 direct response advertising agency focusing exclusively on the Facebook ads platform. Jason’s proprietary methods for ad creation, audience selection and scaling are responsible for producing $20 million + of profitable sales for his clients EVERY YEAR